Outnumbered! Grey Knights

Keeper of the Fortress

Alright everyone. This next installment of Outnumbered! is about The Daemonhunters codex specifically a Grey Knights army. Now I'm not talking about a radical army with daemonhosts and I'm not talking about inquisitorial armies with some grey knights in it. I mean pure Grey Knights (including dreadnoughts and Landraiders). I wont go into any fluff detail really but these guys are the elite of the elite. They fight Daemons and even though they are in desperate need of an update they are still rather good at it.

If you haven't seen many or any armies of these guys do not be surprised. They are like the Witchhunters in that the kits made for these armies are entirely metal. Pricey, heavy and in my opinion annoying to work with. I am not going to talk about the rumors of a new codex for the inquisition or anything in this either.

The Grey Knights are great I am a huge fan of them and if they get plastic models in the future I will make an army of them in a heart beat. I will do a little post about my views on metal models later on.

So onto the heart of the matter. Grey Knights have special rules including fearless, true grit for there storm bolters, and essentially a psychic hood type rule. They have other rules some of which do not matter anymore and regardless I wont be going into detail about the special rules but I will mention the ones I said.

Fearless: Being they are a small army with squad sizes that on average will be small (even though they can have average squad size) the fearless rule is great. The last thing you want to do is fail a leadership check due to shooting or something at range nor do you want to be pinned.

True Grit: its only special here because its for storm bolters and not bolters. All Grey Knights have the Storm bolter as there standard weapon which is great. True grit lets them be dangerous after the charge by giving them an extra attack each. This is handy because the Grey Knights are good assaulters.

The Aegis: This is the psychic hood like rule. Basically works the same. can resist a psychic power by rolling a d6 and adding leadership. You can also have a psychic hood in your army so you have to choose which you will use. You cannot use both. A nice little rule here.

Oh and one more important rule. The Shrouding: Its essentially a weaker version of night fight for Grey Knights. You roll 3d6 time 3 to see if you can see them squad for purposes of targeting them to shoot at. If your in a night fight scenario the night fight rules overrule this. This rule is great. As you are a small force this can be of help. It is 3d6 but still that hurts weapons with long ranges. Granted your troops effective range as a whole is 24 but this can let you close range unmolested on foot for a bit or lets you sit on an objective and force them to get close to be able to shoot you.

Alright so what are the strengths of these units then? Well aside from the special rules these units are strong in the assault. True Grit, Fearless (Which is a good special rule especially for smaller units) are part of their assault specialty. There troops are weapon skill 5 and there Close combat weapon (The Nemesis Force weapon) adds 2 to there space marine strength. So strength 6 for everyone with the weapon. This is what allows them to eek it out against larger units. They are super Space Marines essentially. They are also good at range which I will get to momentarily.

Nemesis Force Weapons: Firstly they are not Force Weapons. Only the Grandmasters counts as a force weapon. These weapons tap into the fluff of the grey knights. basically the weapon gets better in higher ranking hands. basic troops just add 2 to strength. Justicars (Vet sergeants) Terminators and Brother Captains add 2 to there strength and its a power weapon. Grand Masters have a +2 to strength force weapon.

Range combat. Grey Knights are no slouches at this either. With a Stormbolter as standard weaponry they can chew into lightly armored infantry. They can do what Deathwing shooting armies do which is to goad the enemy closer. Basically you move to get your storm bolters in range and fire. Either they stand still and fire once or try and get closer to rapid fire or get into assault. Then your next turn you move away and keep 24 inches and fire again. You basically lead assault armies where you want and this can frustrate the shooty opponents to reposition themselves. It takes some practice but this style of shooting is key. Now there troop squad can have 2 models exchange there weapons for a psycannon or incinerator. Now these are good weapons but you have to think about how you are going to play. Remember these models no longer have a nemesis weapon. The incinerator is a heavy flamer that also ignores invulnerability saves. This is a nice weapon against daemons. It also is great in 5th where cover became so much more important and easy to get. With strength 5 it means youll be wounding more often. The psycannon is an auto cannon can be fired while moving up to 18" or if you do not move it can fire 36". Now it fires 3 time either way but its strength is 6 as opposed to 7 for normal auto cannons. its ap is the same. This weapon also ignore invulnerability saves. I would suggest one squad have incinerators and that squad to be put in a land raider. Ill explain more later on.

So how outnumbered are these guys? Well the basic Grey Knight costs 25 points per model. And the Grey Knight Squad must have a Justicar which is 50 points and at least 4 Grey Knights. So 150 points for 5 guys at least. Keep in mind if you want grenades they cost extra. Also Justicars have access to war gear which could increase the point cost. (I wont go into there wargear. They have a decent amount and what you pick is up to you and your armies style). I will say this it appears Justicars can take targeters. I haven't found anything to refute this so that can be a big help to make sure you'll always be in range.

So for troops how large a squad? Well 5 is too small really. I think 8 man squads are a safe size. You can put 1 or two weapon upgrades per squad and be alright. These squads will cost about as much as Deathwing squads (around 250 points with upgrades). Now these troop choices can be fielded as a fast attack choice. If you do they are kept in reserve and teleport in just like terminators via deep strike. This could be an interesting tactic to think about if you had the points.

What about HQ? Well as we are talking about pure Greyknights that limits you to a Brother Captain or Grand Master. The Grand Master is more then double the brother captains points but he has 3 wounds where the brother captain only has 1. The Grand master has 4 attacks as well as opposed to 3. So who to go for? Well I like having my HQ with more then 1 wound so I personally would bite the bullet and go with a Grand Master. However I have seen viable lists with Brother Captain as an HQ just have to be careful especially if you dump upgrades on him. Now they are only in Terminator Armor and nothing else so I would always take a Land Raider Crusader to put them in. There weapons strike at initiative and are strength 6 that ignore armor saves. You want that striking at there initiative. Now both HQ units can have a retinue of Grey Knight Terminators. Here is where I suggest you get your terminator squad. Just add 4 terminators to the HQ and you have your terminator squad without taking an elite choice up. One thing to point out with Terminator squads in general with Grey Knights is that they can take a psychic power called Holocaust. These uses the ordnance template ( which should be the large template) which can be placed anywhere in contact with the Brother captain or Grand Master as they are focal point. Anyone friend or foe touched takes a str 5 hit normal saves allowed at I 1. This is done in assault phase. It doesn't say anywhere that it takes up his attacks so he can do this in addition to attacking normally. I suggest taking this upgrade as this can really help your squad out. with 2+ saves you will be pretty safe and this can help trim down large horde units. This ability can allow you to assault very large units and come out on top. It does require a psychic test. Also 1 terminator can upgrade there stormbolter to a incinerator or psycannon I would suggest the psycannon because they can always fire the heavy 3 option 36" range one because they have relentless due to the armor.

Now there are two other units for pure Grey Knights. There Dreadnought (Which is a heavy support choice for them) and The Purgation squad which is like a devastator squad. If you go with a dreadnought I would field it with a Lascannon and its CCW. The psycannon is a nice option for it but the army lacks long range anti tank punch so the twin linked Lascannon is in my opinion better.

The purgation squad is an interesting squad. it can be as small as 3 models. They are like devastators in that they can exchange there weapons for others. up to 4 grey knights can exchange there weapons for Psycannons or Incinerators. This unit I like but I do not know if I would field one. Its points heavy but can be really effective. With 4 psycannons you can lay down good covering fire and still move and shoot it if necessary. With 4 incinerators you can potentially wipe even space marine squads if they are bunched up. If you try them out Do not mix the weapons. I mean you could and that could work on a highly mobile unit but keeping it purely one or the other will maximize the weapons.

So what do you do? Well I suggest regardless of what HQ you take a 4 terminator retinue. Now take 2 squads of 8 Grey Knights for troop choices. Now take 2 Land Raiders one of which is a Crusader and give them smoke. This small force will run you just about 1500 points. Now this is a viable force its just much harder to use. You could drop a land Raider for another troop choice but if you do I would suggest dropping the crusader because you need those Lascannons to deal with armor. I personally would field both Land Raiders.

You would play this force conservatively with your HQ squad in or near the crusader and the incinerator squad in or near the land raider. Always move your forces. Depending on the mission keep the psycannon equipped unit on an objective or in cover near one and give cover fire. But dont be afraid to move them back if need be. Keep the Land Raiders near the Grey Knights so in a pinch you can mount up and drive away or towards an objective. In this style of play the Land Raiders also need to shoot as much as possible especially the regular land raider. That is your only source of long range anti vehicle. The key here is really to maximize your shooting and to wipe whole squads out. The assault phase is where the Knights excel but you should not rush there. This is of course not set in stone. For example against Tau you should still shoot a lot but while trying to get into assault as they out range and can quickly outgun your small force due to less targets for marker lights.

Now 1750 is becoming very popular so in this case i would add a 3rd troop squad. If you did this in 1500 then i would add the second land raider now.

This is my view on a pure Grey Knights force. Its small but if you maximize shooting and make full use of all there gear you will be able to overcome your very small size. I would say that the Grey Knights are probably one of the smallest forces you can field aside from deathwing. And I would say these two armies are essentially tied for smallest army as depending on how you build them one would be slightly smaller then the other.

Up next in this series will probably be Codex Space Marines Bike armies as they are different enough from Ravenwing to warrant some attention.

Quest for Knowledge

Greetings. I had these guys done for almost a week now just have not had time to post them. Ok sorry in advance for the poor pic quality. I will eventually get a better picture taking place then my work area. SO here it is my Mechanicus Battlefleet Gothic Exploratory fleet.

I have one more of these types of escorts but its base is broken and I still have the escorts I did a while back. But this is the Mechanicus fleet essentially. Nothing fancy just grey red and bronze. I think it turned out well. Probably the fastest army type group that I've painted. A BFG fleet can look really good with minimal effort. Enjoy.

Outnumbered! Cult Chaos Marines

Hey all. I could not make it to a local gaming shop for a tournament so thought id do Outnumbered! Chaos cult marines now. NOTE im not going to actually go into the fluff of each legion talked about here. There fluff explains why they have certai nstats and certain limitations.

What do I mea nbut Cult armies? Well what i mean when i say that is an army devoted solely to one god and to me in order to be a "true" cult army you need to use there specific special troop choice and not just a chaos marine squad with an icon. So basically: Noise Marines, Plague Marines, Beserkers or Thousand Sons Rubric Marines. Essentially an army devoted to one of the cult legions. The army is as much a fluff army as it is specialized. So no Sorcerer with lash in a Khorne Army. Also other infantry units tend to be given the icon of that god as well. Basically the army is built to fit the fluff of that legion.

So the legions are for those of you that may not know are: Emperor's Children (devoted to Slaanesh). Deaht Guard (Devoted to Nurgle), World Eaters, Devoted to Khorne and Thousand Sons (Devoted to Tzeentch). So a cult army would pick a legion and the appropriate troop choice for that army. The question to ask now before you make your list is to go with Favored number or not.

Favored Number you say? Each God has a sacred number and they are: 6 for Slaanesh, 7 for Nurgle, 8 for Khorne and 9 for Thousand Sons. Now there is no benefit for going favored number anymore aside from being fluffy. So do you do it or not? I say it depends obviously 6 man squads are a bit on the small side. However you can also do multiples ( ie. 6 or 12 for Slaanesh) this can keep the theme of favored numbers alive for slaanesh and keep your units alive. This can become expensive however.

Ok so what do you do for an HQ? Well that is up to you. You could make it really cult like and field the appropriate special character or a generic HQ option with appropriate mark. This is up to the player. Id go wit ha special character just because I think it helps give the feel of a cult legion.

Ok a few overall pointers. These armies are specialized and with all the icons and potential upgrades being bought it can quickly become a small army. Be careful. Noise Marines do not al needsonic weapons for example (although it is cool). The troops are expensive but are general superior in one way to normal chaos marines (T5 on plague marines for example). Also all your troops are fearless remember that. This is a good thing as it keeps your dice rolling down a bit. As we all know even with Ld 10 after enoug hdie rolls we fail them eventually. Alright now it is time to get to the heart of the matter. NOTE all cult troops except for Thousand Sons can upgrade to have a champion for +15. Thousand Sons are different and ill explain in there section.

Emperor's Children: These guys are devoted to Slaanesh and as such there troops are Noise Marines. Favore number is 6. These troops are the cheapest starting out of the cult troop choices. They can quickly become one of the most expensive. Every unit can upgrade there weapon to a sonic weapon of some kind. at 20 point base with the basic sonic weapon upgrade being 5 point that means 25 points a model minimum. The other sonic wepaon cost 40 points and is for one marine only. So what are these guys good at? Well two things. One is they have initiative 5 which means they strike first against most other troops and even elites of most armies. This means that while not assault specialists they can recieve charges better then regular chaos marines and are better at charging. With there sonic weapons they are the ebst foot sloggers in this codex as the weapons are all assault weapons. Essentially a squad of storm bolters plus the basic one can be assault 2 or heavy 3. The other one has two profiles one that is an assault weapon the other is heavy. So you can Rhino push and still have decent small arms fire which is really good. You can also walk them foward and back keepign the enemy in range all the while. If you dont move you can really put the hurt on light infantry with heavy 3 shots per basic sonic weapon depending o nsquad size you can potentially wope out decent size units. So do you favored number them? My opinion is have one or two units of 12 with full sonic weapon upgrades and kit out your champion for assault and give them rhinos. Any other squads upgrade as your discretion. With two units of 12 with full sonic weapons you can whittle down horde armies rather well. This army while having high initiative is more shooty so supplement your noise marines with some anti tank punch. Shoot a lot and then steal the assault with your I5 guys. This armies weakness is all the upgrades. each marine troop choice that falls is 25 points a model if with sonci weapons. All the basic anti marine weakenss apply here as well (massed small arms fire etc etc).

Death Guard. These guys are devoted to Papa Nurgle. Favored number is 7. I think 7 is safe for these guys but if you dont want to be limited by favored number then nothing over 10 unless its an apocalypse game. These guys have toughness of 5 and feel no pain. This is huge making them have high staying power. They are tied in first for best staying power troop choice in the chaos codex. Tied with Rubric Marines (ill explain in there section). Now in 4th they were the king of staying in the chaos codex but with the changes to feel no pain they are a little bit weaker. These guys weigh in at 23 points a model. the champion can get the usual weapon upgrades. What is nice to note is they have in addiotn to frag and krak grenades the blight grenade. This is a defensive grenade and it helps them deal with ther weakness which ill explain later. Now the unit can have two marines upgrade there bolter to a special weapon (melta plasma etc) but not heavy weapons. This isgood because you can move and shoot everything albiet at a reduced range. But you can have two melta guns plus the combi melta power fist champion can make a mean anti tank squad. Combine that wiht a rhino with combi melta and you got an anti tank unit that can move. This can be done with plasma of a flamer as well. So you can have a anti terminator plasma squad and an anti horde flamer squad. Feel no pain works with gets hot so you have a bit more staying power with that. These guys are great at sitting on objectives. In cover these guys are hard to get rid of and being fearless they wont run. put in a rhino they can rush an enemy objective and with there higher toughness they can contest for longer. I would back up these troops with nurgle bikers. Toughness 6 bikes is nothing to laugh at. the Nurlge Icon is one of the better all purpose ones. T5 havocs to give some long range punch to the army for example. This is an army that can deal with massed small arms fire better then any other chaos army. This armies weakness is that plague marines are I3. Now there blight grenades help with this and of course T5 also helps with this but should a large asault army or unit hit you guys T5 and feel no pain can only help for so long. Also it is imporant to keep in mind feel no pain. Doublt strength power weapns and ap 2 or 1 (and str d in apoc), and rending will bypass your feel no pain. this means that rending wounds and plasma wound which used to not bypass I believe will now bypass. This is critical with armies that have the ability to get ap1 like Witch Hunters with that faith power. This isnt a critical weakness as its built into the rule that they have but it is important to remember. As you will be outnumbered by even regular chaos armies. However they can soak up str 4 and lower weapons better then other troops.

World Eaters. These guys are devoted to Khorne. There favored number is 8. While I would run a squad or two with the favored number I would suggest going 10 man for more attacks in close combat. THey are 21 points a model. These guys are close combat monsters. WS of 5 Furious Charge and base 2 attacks in there profile means many attacks and on the carge they hit harder and go before other marines and at the same time as noise marines. Keep in mind they have a pistol and close combat weapon so on the charge thats is 4 attacks a model (5 for the champion unless he has a powerfist then he has 4). So a squad of 10 wit ha champion with a powrfist has a total of 40 attacks on the charge at I5 str5. Thats huge especially againt horde armies. Remember that the powrfists are str 9 on the charge not 10. Back these guys up with some khorne raptors for fast hits or with defilers to give long range shooting with there cannon. What I would do is take Land Raiders. Armor 14 with lascannons and being an asault vehicle will get your beserkers into the fray fast. Every Beserker squad should have a transport either rhino or Land Raider. This armies Weakness is that they are devoted solely to assaulting. The troop choice only has pistols for shoting. You can give plasma pistols and I would give 1 per squad at most if at all. You have to be careful if you shoot your pistols and the unit runs at the end of the phase your unit is high and dry and will be shot to bits. Backing these troops up with transports and things that can shoot farther (Land Raiders, Defilers even predators) is critical. This style of army is harder then people think. You cannot just run foward without a plan. Being able to maximize your assaulting while utilizing shooting attacks is a delicate balancing act.

Thousand Sons. These guys are devoted to Tzeentch. There favored number is 9. I wouldnt field them in units larger then 9. Thats what you get in there box, 1 aspiring sorcere and 8 marines. By the way I dunno if this box will get an update but it needs one baaaad. Plastic tech has gotten better and im sure they could easily make these guys all plastic which would be much better then the hybrid plastic pewter they are now. Anways these guys weigh in at 23 points a model. While this is the same as plague marines these squads are probably the most expensive before upgrades. This is because unlike the rest of the troop choices they dont get a champion. They have an aspiring sorcerer that is required and costs 60 points. Also it must take 1 psychic power. These squad have a 4+ invulnerable save which is great as it makes them one of the best foot sloggers. They are Slow and purposeful which makes them relentless but slow when moving. This iswhy they arent the best foot sloggers hand down but are still really good. Keep in ind the aspiring sorcere is not slow and purposeful so if he is the last one left he can move normally. They also have inferno bolts. These make there bolters ap3 which is great against Marines and Marine like armies. This however doesnt do much againt horde armies that are used to not having asave against normal bolters. This being said we all know there are plenty of marine armies and other Marine like armies. They cannot take any upgrades and have no grenades. This is ok though because the aspiring sorcerer has a psychic power. I would suggest either doombolt or Bolt of Change. They are in my mind the best powers to give your aspiring sorcerers. Doombolt is good for increasing the number of shots and can help against horde armies. Bolt of Change is one attack at the same range as a bolter at str 8 and ap of 1 and it is an assault weapon. This is good because it allows the squad to be more versatile by allowing your sorcere to destroy vehicles. Gift of Chaos and Winds of Chaos are also good options if you wish. This is a shooting army that can walk itself across the board all the while firing there bolters at max range and denying armor save to all but 2+. With the amount of cover saves available now I would be careful and keep my distance while still shooting. They are equal to plague Marines in staying power because of there invulnerable save. Sure small arms fire hurts them just the same as normal marines but they can take a demolisher cannon and keep on coming. This is why i think they are equal because as troops are so important in fifth people will throw heavy weapons against them. The assault phase is there wekaness but they are not helpess. The sorcerer has a force weapon and the squad has a invulnerable save. This armies wekaness is that while they are good at footsloggin they are slow if you roll poorly for slow and purposeful. On average theyll move 4 inches a turn so they are slow. If you lock them in assault you can wither them down as only the sorcerer has a weapon that ignores armor. Do not count them out though as they do have a marine stat line so they can hold there own in the assault. Also another wekaness is there special rule of the sorcerer commands. This essentially means that if the aspiring sorcerer is killed the squad then only rolls 1d6 as opposed to 2d6.

Alright to wrap up ill talk briefly on the daemon weapons and steeds. The daemosn weapons vary for each god. Slaanesh causes instant death, khorne rolls 2d6 for extra attacks, nurgle always wounds on a 4+ and tzeentch rolls 1d6 for shooting and for assault. They all have there risks for if you roll a 1 you do nothing and take a wound. Khorne and Tzeetnch have the highest risks but also can do more damage. They count as power weapons. They are not essential for a lord and should only be considered if you plan to be able to use them. ALso only Chaos Lords can take them.

The Steeds are alright. I am not goign to go into them as the only one i really seen used was the disc of tzeentch which lets you move as jump infantry. They all have there uses but for this tacical read they do not change anything for being outnumbered. They can be used by Lords and Sorcerers.

Thats about it for a overview of cult armies and being outnumbered. Remember this is my opinion on the matter and the strengths and weaknesses are as I see them. In knowning these things you can develop lists and strategies for your armies.

I am not sure what I am going to talk on next. So ill keep it a secret. Until then I hope this helped.

Tactica outnumbered!

Keeper of the Fortress

Alright folks Another installment of my opinions on matters concerning tips and tactics. This installment is on being outnumbered. Now if you play horde or just large armies you can still read but this is meant for those of use who are outnumbered on a regular basis.

Now starting off people view being outnumbered as a weakness inherent in the armies that comprise this (Grey Knights, Chaos Thousand Sons, Deathwing, Ravenwing etc etc). Now while this is indeed a drawback this can also be considered a strength.

Know your Strengths

-Being small can be of help. If you win the dice roll have your opponent set up to go first. Then you set up your smaller army to be able to attack a smaller portion of the larger enemy. Of course the enemy may try to redeploy via movement but anything that makes your opponent do something they may not want to is an advantage in my eyes. Make no mistake though being outnumbered is still a fundamental drawback of these armies. Les bodies to capture and less bodies that can fall.

-Deployment is Key. As mentioned above you could make your opponent go first in turn and deployment but in the cases where you either want to go first or are made to go first. Deploying your forces effectively is always key and more so when your outnumbered.

- Play to your armies strength. This is obvious. Chaos Thousand Sons are good at shooting so maximize that. I am of the mind that unless your typical shooting range is pistols like Beserkers you should maximize your shooting. This will vary depending on how you build deathwing for example as you could have an assault heavy force or shooting heavy. This is 40k battles in the future I always say use your guns when you can. Again if your main gun is a pistol then you have to play smart to get in and assault.

-Play to the mission. Annihilation aside there are objectives to capture. Do not forget this. Its something that even veteran players can do. You get caught up in the slaughter or are just enjoying the fighting and before you know it your either too outstretched or too weakened to take objectives. NOTE: Necrons have a built in secondary objective of phase out. Sometimes going for the phase out could be better then going for objectives. Now this depends on the enemy Necron force and your own as well as the mission. Now in Annihilate the gloves are off and just make sure to utterly destroy a unit before moving to the next so you get that point.

-Don't let your opponent get into your head. What this means is that against a tyranid swarm or Ork horde army id you look upon the enemy and say "I can't kill all that" you really are weakening yourself before the game starts. You'll be more cautious. The mind war is just as important at the luck of the dice roll. If you can make your opponent wonder why our so confident you have a higher chance of them slipping up.

-Be bold. Remember tactics never truly make it to the battle. Id you can confuse or surprise your opponent in a manner that benefits you that always helps.

I know this is all old hat to many of us but any one of us can forget these overtime or just not apply it because we are too busy thinking of other things in the game.

Know your weakness and make them your Strength

Basically if your army is weak in the assault then use that to your advantage. Aggressive shooting and smart target prioritizing can keep that assault heavy force your facing back for one more crucial turn. While it would be nice to be able to shoot down the assaulting horde before it gets to you it rarely happens. But the more shooting you get in the better.

-Sacrifice. We all know to be prepared for casualties. but sometimes sacrifice is in order.Speed bumps are less around in small armies but a transport or a whittled down squad can be used in that role. Now its not the best idea for small armies like this but if it give the rest of your army an extra hassle free turn then go for it.

Now I'm not going to go into army specific tactics here but maneuvering your army is critical. Also read up on your armies rules. For example a Thousand sons squad in a rhino is pretty nice. Give them essentially a 36" shot by moving twelve getting out and then shooting as they are relentless via slow and purposeful (last i checked that works anyway). Basically all armies have either special rulings or there own unique strengths that have to be exploited constantly.

So essentially my point of view is that unless your assault specialized only (like World Eaters) you should shoot as much as possible. My reasoning for this is that most horde style armies have bad armor saves. And even with all the cover saves now you can negate there armor with your guns. In assault you'll have usually 1 guy that can negate armor saves consistently. Now granted a 6+ is nothing but lucky dice rolls can really hamper you. Deathwing is the exception as regardless of what you give them its a power weapon. However with Deathwing they are small squads and one of the smaller armies so you have to be careful.

One final tip is don't be afraid to spend points on things if it will enhance your armies ability. With Beserkers for example they are great in the assault. And while Rhinos really help them get across the board you may want to invest in a Land Raider. Better survivability, can assault out of it and it has some heavy weaponry if it survives dropping the beserkers off. Also it'll draw fire away from the rest of your army.

Thats about it. Mostly just a reminder on things we all forget. This is just the beginning. I plan to go into detail in other installments which are based on a specific codex for each installment of: Outnumbered! So stay tuned. I think the first will be Chaos cult armies. That means for those that don't know armies that are dedicated to one chaos god and at least in my eyes the troop selections should only consist of the specific unit for that god (Plague Marines for example). I will cover each god in this next installment so it will be a bit long. Until then!

Crusade era terminator shoulders

Alright so this is a mini tutorial on how to make the terminator shoulder pads on the previous post. This really is a lesson in salvaging. Now there are plenty of tutorials on how to make them from the barrels cut in half to dreadnought leg guards to scratch building with plastic card and/or greenstuff. This is just scrounging around through bits.

These are the pads when on a terminator. A little big perhaps but I like that look. Makes it look ceremonial and that fits with the Thousand Sons.

This is the bit off the sprue. Basically you just glue thin strips of plasticard to it to make the pad. its pretty simple. Id suggest using a reasonably thin plasticard so it can bend. I also suggest attaching the plasticard to the pad then paint it up and attach to the terminator. With the thin plasticard it can bend a bit to help fit onto the terminator if the arms are a little in the way.

This is the bit on the sprue. It should be on the same sprue as the bladed prow that i used for the terminators khopesh (which has its own tutorial).

That's basically it. Not much to show. How crazy you go with the plasticard strips to simulate leather is up to you. I don't know how it works with other chariot kits. But these bits can work with other legions such as Death Guard, Ultramarines, World Eaters. It depends on which bit you use of course but it could work.

Some more stuff to come soon. Hope that was a bit helpful at last with ideas on how to use other bits you may have.

Crusade Era Terminators

Hello all. I have made some progress on my Crusade era Thousand Sons. In this case the 3 terminators i needed for my squad which is being fielded as allied Grey Knights.

I followed the same paint scheme as with my previous thousand son stuff. Those shoulder pads are actually from the Tomb King Chariot box. I will post a mini tutorial on how to create the pads. Its a little large but I like the look of it. I think it fits well.

Army starting insight

Keeper of the Fortress

Hello again. As promised I will share my opinions on some things. Firstly I will be discussing my views on building an army. Now there are two way you can build your army: Planned and build as you go. Both have there merits and both can be hard especially for someone new.

With the random 40k Event my friends and I are doing i started thinking about how to build up an army which involves the army list and the two ways mentioned above came to mind.

Firstly Planned. This means that you sit down with your codex and write out the blueprints of your army aka the Army List. You may work on it and change it a bit but he final product is more or less what you want to build. From there you make your army. I find this works well with armies like Space Marines, Chaos, Eldar, and Orks for example. Why these army types? Well because with space marines for example if you model the marine with a plasmagun or heavy weapon then that is what the marine is stuck with unless you remove it and replace it. (I am not going to touch the subject of proxies at all.) With Chaos and eldar it is a similar thing. A howling banshee can only represent a banshee and a berserker cannot represent a plague marine for example. With Orks you can have slugga boyz but to represent shoota boyz you would need more models. Get my meaning? The planned army list is best with these armies and armies like them.

Build as you go: This is where you find a cool model or unit and you buy it and then factor it into your army. With this style of army building you have to be careful because you could change your mind and not need that unit. Now of course we all have bought something because it looks so cool and rarely get to use it. The two armies that I feel can work the best with this are Necrons and Imperial Guard. Why? Well with Necrons there are no real unit upgrades that you need to model with the exception being your Lord. Everything else in the army has equipment that does not change. You still have to keep them specific so immortals only represent immortals but its easier then the other armies listed above. Why Imperial Guard you may wonder? Well a chimera can be use by a lot of units. Guardsmen can represent a variety of units from conscripts to command squad. Heavy weapon teams can be used as support squads there own heavy weapon unit or to represent a heavy weapon in a squad of guardsmen. Sentinels can be fast attack or part of the command platoon thing. Essentially its easy to fit in units to these types of armies.

Now neither method is better then the other. I find that an army that you really enjoy (For example Dark Angels for me) that either method works as you wont mind having extra models. Essentially you want to build up and own as much as you can for that army. If you are going to branch out into new armies i find the planned method works best as you will have a solid idea of what exactly you need.

Now for New players my best suggestion would be to mix the two approaches. Establish a core which would be an HQ that you like configured how you want and 2 or 3 troop choices configured however you want them to legally be. From there as you learn the rules you can make easier tweaks to the army and impulse buys may fit better as you ll have a strong core already.

Hope that insight was helpful to people. Many of us know this already but we don't always follow it.

So what do you do when you build your armies? I personally do both. If I am trying to make a tough as nails list ill strictly plan.

More stuff to come in the future.

Status report

Hey all. Just thought id make a little update post. Now all i did for this picture below is make him a new base and started some minor touch ups on his helmet. I may do a little more touch up on him in the future. He is a Dark Angel Deathwing Interrogator Chaplain.

I got some more BFG stuff to paint so I think I will work on them and bases for my Crusade Thousand Sons. Depending how fast I can base and paint the 8 escorts and 3 cruisers I may be able to get started on the actual crusade terminators soon.

I want to post some Tactica that I use when i play games but I do not know what exactly. I may do something on general things. I also have another idea in mind so stay tuned some tips and tactics to come aside from just progress reports on what I'm working on.

Oh just so any followers are aware. I play Dark Angels and codex marines. I have some Tau and a few chaos. I have played with my tau and i know a good amount of how to play chaos marines. I am also working on Orks for that challenge. So if you have any army specific questions especially about any Space Marine army except space wolves feel free to leave a comment with your question. This goes for the other armies listed above. I will do my best to answer them with my opinions in a post. If no one does that its fine I will still do what I have in mind as well. Until then.

Kahotep

Hello all. A small update. Here we have a pre heresy thousand son Commander. I named him Kahotep:

His wargear mimics that of Sicarius because i do plan to use him as a counts as model for Sicarius. He would be a second HQ model to go with my Count as Tigirius (Ahriman or Mhotep from the HH novel). So why do you ask? Well I like the Fluff of the Thousand Sons and having a high degree of Psychic potential within the legion. I think the rules of Sicarius best mesh with this theme.

So yea there he is. I like how he came out. When next I work on the army it'll be on the Terminators. When thatll be? Not sure but it wont be a long delay. Id like to have my 1500 point army done by spring.

That and other things to come when i have time to collect my thoughts onto here. Until then.

The Dakka Ladz Big Captain

Hey all as stated earlier I rolled Orks for the random 40k event. Luckily for me that meant just one guy to paint. I decided to make a freeboota Ork horde cause Ork pirates are fun. They are called the Dakka Ladz. So here is my HQ:

His names is Grax Dakka Goldteef. And yes it says Yo Ho! on his Gob. He is "Da Big Kaptain" of the Dakka Ladz and because of this he counts as Ghazghkull. I went with a purple color scheme because i think its a good color for ork pirates. Gave him a Gold gob because its styling. The purple is hormagaunt purple base with Liche Purple over it and a wash of leviathan purple. It looks better in color then with this picture. He doesn't have a Matte Varnish yet and I think ill do that soon because he is a big pewter model.

Anyways I'm done with the first part of the event. Once we start phase 2 in Jan. I will post an update on the event. Of course as i make progress on my other projects ill post as well.

So enjoy and Take care.

So it begins

Hey all. Not much to update with here. However the Random 40k event has started! First deadline for us is January 8th. Why so late you ask? Well one among our group is doing a forgeworld order for stuff and it takes some time so we made it a little longer. I will be joining him in that order but not for this event.

Anyway I rolled Orks for mine. another of our group rolled orks and two rolled imperial guard. I believe one other is doing eldar. Should be fun as we all have different styles for what we are going to do.

So what I bought for my HQ is Ghazkull's model. Why? Because its a cool looking beefy ork model. He is a bit points heavy and I need a name for him still but it fits the little fluff i made for the army. Basically I'm running a freeboota ork pirate army. Only instead of going crazy with boyz I'm using purely shoota boyz. for troops and a meganobz troop choice because of the warboss. Basically this model will represent the leader of the Freebootaz. THey are called the Dakka Ladz. Normally the list i have would use a big mek shokk attack gun and a warphead weird boy but i figured id do something different for this challenge.

So yea updates with that model hopefully soon. I plan to get him done asap cause it'll be a nice change and i want to continue work on my Marines too. But we are on our way. SO if anyone wants to follow along your more then welcome to. If you have an suggestions of Orky pirate leader name for a ork group that loves the sound of gunz and the smell of propellant lemme know and ill take a look at em.

Until then..

Random 40k!!

Hey everyone. I cam up with an idea a while ago and talked to my friend on it. And after talking with Helios Raven (link on the right with the other blogs). Basically its a modified escalation type event thing. And Helios suggested we randomize it and thats what we did. I wrote up a guideline type thing for it and we decided to post it on our blogs here as well as other stuff.

Feel free to do this with your friends or group.

Random 40k Army Challenge

Welcome to the random 40k army challenge. What is this you ask? Well this is a long term group activity. You and a group of friends randomly choose a 40k army and slowly build each of your armies at the same rate. This is designed to be done in addition to any other army your working on and is broken down accordingly to allow people to still work on there current army idea. After each part is complete you have a little brawl as either a crazy free for all or by randomly choosing who fights who. First lets get to how you choose your army.

Alright so basically there are two ways to choose your army. Either by putting the armies into a hat and choosing or by rolling dice and consulting the following list:

1. Imperial Guard
2. Orks
3. Eldar
4. Chaos Space Marines
5. Inquisition
6. Necrons
7. Space Marines
8. Chaos Daemons
9. Tau
10. Tyranids
OPTIONAL
11. Dark Eldar
12. Reroll

Ok so why are the Dark Eldar optional to add? Its not because we hate them but because the models are hard to find without ordering online and the codex cannot be found in stores. Now when the new codex and models come out then they wont be optional. If yoru group agrees to them then by all means add them in. Obviously without the dark Eldar you would roll a d10 and with them in you would roll a d12.

Great! You have your army picked out now how does this event work? It’s a series of parts explained below. But please note all models must be WYSIWYG (What you see is what you get) so choose your equipment carefully.

Part 1: Establishing a chain of command. Everyone picks one HQ that is legal for your army that would take up a force organization slot (so no Emperors Champions, command squads, etc.). The HQ unit must be fully painted and based. Once everyone has completed there HQ you have a HQ brawl. Yea it may not be fair for some HQ’s but its just for fun and so everyone sees the models.

Part 2: Troops win the war. Now that everyone has picked there HQ you move one to ONE troop selection from your codex.(ie. A tactical space marine squad). The squad must be atleast minimum size and can go to maximum size. Yes it is only one troop selection so one troop choice. Also dedicated transports are not allowed at this time unless the selection requires a transport (example: Pathfinders need a devilfish but they are not troops so you cannot make a squad of them here). Also squad character upgrades (Ie, Telion, changeling etc) are allowed. The troops selection must be fully painted and based. Once everyone is done you have another small brawl with your HQ and troop selection.

Part 3: A proper battle group. This is exactly as above but this gives you your second troop selection making your forces actually force organization legal. The two troops are split apart for two reasons. One monetary constraints, this allows everyone to participate as everything is spaced. Also some squads are huge like ork boys this allows people to take some time to make a nice force. Once everyone has there second troop selection complete you can fight either a free for all, team game, or one on one battles. Obviously the size of yoru group may dictate which way you fight.

Part 4: Reinforcements are en-route. Alright its time to wage real war. You have your HQ and 2 compulsory troops. What now? Well no you flush out your army. You are able to expand your army as you see fit from your codex. So dedicated transports can be added in here a second HQ or things like command squads or a Emperor’s Champion. Now don’t go too crazy there is a point limit. The limit can be either750, 850 or 950 points. Your group must come to an agreement on which one you choose. If someone is already above 750 for some reason then obviously you would have to go with a higher point limit. There are options to give flexibility to people with time constraints. Also keep in mind everything must be force organization legal. So elites for example can only have 3 slots. Again everything must be fully painted and based. Once everyone is done then you can start fighting actual battles utilizing missions and deployment from the rulebook.

Part 5: Escalation. The armies should be shaping up nicely now. Its time to expand upon the forces you have collected. The armies can be expanded up to 1200 points. As always you have to follow the force organization chart. Once everyone has fully painted and based the additional units its time for another battle. From this point on you should be fighting standard battles as either one on one or team battles using the mission and deployment tables.

Part 6: Time to make war. Its time to bring the army up to a decent minimum playing level. Players can expand there army up to 1500 points. Again force organization chart must be adhered to and all models must be painted and based by the end of the time limit. After everyone has finished more battles to be fought. You could have a impromptu mini tournament at this point to get games in against more people.

Part 7: Let’s get Dangerous. Alright this is it. This is where all this time has been going towards. This is the final part where everyone is able to expand there army to 1750 points. Once everyone has fully painted and based there additions everyone should play a game against each other person.

Congratulations! You all now have an army fully painted anf finished and its an army that you may not have been able to get to otherwise!

Sound like something you would be interested in? Well great! Now here are some specifics to how this works.

When picking an army it is best to keep it random. However there is one re-roll allowed (or re-pick if you did it out of a hat). Now this is of course meant to be fun so more then once is fine if your group is fine with that. Also As this is a great way to get new people into the game that may be interested if someone is new and wants in but like a specific race they can of course pick that race. This is not meant to discourage any new people from joining the hobby.

You probably noticed that there are 7 parts yet no mention of time limitations. That should be determined by your group but in general 3 weeks to 3 months per part is a good amount of time. For the first few parts 3 weeks should be well enough time but for something like part 4 which is probably the biggest point jump 3 months may be necessary. Remember this is a casual army build meant to be done on the side while you are working on your current main army so you do not need to speed demon this stuff. Also once your group finishes on part you need not jump right into the next part. While that may be possible at certain time the parts are meant to be started once the group as a whole can continue. So any amount of time can pass between the end of one part and the beginning of another.

A note on models:

As stated earlier all models must be WYSIWYG. But that does not mean you have to stick to 40k units or blisters. This is the time to get funky as we are building armies in small stages. Conversions are not only allowed, they are encouraged. Now of course the 40k line may have that model you need or want but done be afraid to look at the other ranges from Games Workshop either. As long as in the end the model is WYSIWYG as best as possible its all good.

Another thing to keep in mind is that each part should only be started once everyone can participate. This means when everyone has the models and painting supplies they need. If someone had to order there model off the internet then everyone should wait until that person gets there model. The goal is for everyone to progress as one and have fun.

Interested in taking this further? No problem it is easy to go past 1750 if you want to just progress by 250 point each time! Also if your group want to spice things up by turning the games played into a tournament type thing then go for it. This is just the baseline by which you and a group of friends can start something new (or a variant of an existing race for you crazy veterans) and progress together.

TIPS:

These aren’t so much tips on how to do well in this event but on how to have fun.
- If you plan out an army list and break into stages that go with the parts you may find it easier to know what you have to buy.
- Share your lists with each other. You never know what bits your friends may have that you could use to make your army.
- It’s not necessary to have a 1750 list in the beginning Sometimes it’s more fun to pick as you go and make it fit into the constraints.

Well this is a fluid event meaning that it can be added to or revised as necessary.

Good luck and Have fun!

[We aren't sticklers on WYSISYG and by that I mean bolt pistols don't need to be modeled on marines for example. If you want to that's great but basically only war gear items need to be modeled.]

Its really segmented and really lose time wise because its meant as stated before to be built while working on your main army. Also its a great way to get new players and people interested into the game as well! Just let them choose what they want and participate. Anyways sorry for the length hope you all enjoy. When I roll for my army ill post what i got and my choice for my HQ! Take care.

Prepare Starboard weapons to fire!

Hey there. Here is a bit of an update. Two capital ships.

This is the Thunderchild above. The apocalypse Battleship. Painted in Angels of Fury colors.

The Battle barge Angelic Fury. Obviously in Angels of Fury colors.

They were assembled by Helios Raven link on the right side. More on the way eventually when the order comes in and such. Working on crusade era Thousand Sons now. More to come soon when I have time to post something more substantial. Sorry for the bad pictures. Hope you enjoy. Until next time.

My counts as Pedro Kantor

Another thing I finished during the little paint fest. He is for my Angels of Fury Army.

He is Supreme Grand Master Uriel. Chapter Master of the Angels of Fury. He counts As Pedro Kantor rules wise. same wargear obviously. I plan to make multiple Uriel models namely one with Azrael's gear. They are a Dark Angels successor chapter but I plan to primarily use the Space Marine codex with them. Anyway. I like the helmet. It almost kinda looks like the eyes are glowing when seen in person.

Anyways that's about it for what Ive actually completed. I made some progress on my Battle Barge and Apocalypse class Battleship (in Angels of Fury colors) but they are not done. When I finish them ill post them of course. Once I'm done with all that its back to crusade era thousand sons. Until next time.

For the Omnissiah

Hey everyone. Had another paint fest type thing and I made some more progress! Here is one of the things I finished.

Its a Mechanicum Battleship for Battlefleet Gothic. Thanks goes to http://heliosravensnest.blogspot.com/ for assembling this and other ships. He is a good assembler. I painted it to fill double duty. Its in the same color scheme as my Angels of Fury as well as being able to fill its primary role as a Mechanicum battleship. Game wise ill be using it as the Omnissiah's Victory ship for my mechanicum fleet. Fluff wise its the Angels of Fury Forge ship.

Colors used are Adeptus Battlegrey, dwarven bronze, mechrite red, chaos black, badab black wash. Matte Varnished for protection.

Well that's it for this guy. Hope you enjoy. Until next time.

Looks like ill need 2 more.

Mesy messy workspace. Anyway. Ive been pretty sick and its reflected in my drop pod unfortunately. Its done and it serves its purpose but i totally dropped the ball on this one. Maybe when i feel better and after i work on some other stuff ill try and salvage it. the big problem is its misaligned slightly. I dont know how I did it but I did. I could remove the pylons easily enough its the center data console thats on there firmly. Its salvagable i just am lazy.

Now the drop pod can serve its purpose in a game. its built badly but built and its painted. SO I can use it but chances are im just going to buy 2 more instead of the one more i originally needed. So learn from my mistakes and dont assembly under the influence of medication. You think yoru doing great until you sober up.

Its a great kit and a very precise kit so when i eventually start on one again ill talk about it. Anyways up next is my counts as Pedro Kantor for this army his name is Master Uriel. After that is probably my capital ships for BFG then either more BFG or crusade era Thousand sons.

Sweeping last sector now..

Hey all. Yesterday was a little spur of the moment paint-a-thon with a friend of mine. It was eventful as I made a little progress on my drop pod and some assembly for my Angels of Fury HQ choice. I also start work on some Battlefleet Gothic (BFG) stuff. I finished three nova escorts and started base coating my battlebarge. Since the Nova squadron is done here are the pictures of em.


There nothing spectacular. There done in theme with my Angels of Fury chapter. All my imperial and space marine vessels and mechanicus vessels that I want to get over time will be painted in this way as per my chapters fluff.

Anyway BFG stuff is fast to paint. Assembly is a nightmare for the larger ships as there is no instructions but my friend was nice enough to assemble them for me. Check out Helios Ravens 40k blog at http://heliosravensnest.blogspot.com/. He is helping me out with the assembly of the larger ships aka assembling them and trying to salvage my Thunderfire Cannon as it was a bad mold.

Other then the larger ships potentially being a problem in terms of assembly they are fun and easy to paint. Another nice thing is that escort ships are usually 1 to 2 pieces. Hardest part about painting these guys is basecoating them. although you could do a spray base coat if you wanted. I am just going with brushing it on and it can be a pain to get the paint into the recesses. After the base coat its really up to you how detailed you want to be with yours. I just semi drybrushed adeptus battlegrey on the ship, picked out the engines in black and painted the Lance weaponry in bronze. Then i gave the whole thing a wash of badab black and sealed it with a matte varnish.

So yea anyway that's a little change of pace. I still will be working on the drop pod so when i have time to make more progress I shall. Until then..

Small Update

Its been a bit but here is a small update.

Like ive said i switched gears and started on the Drop pod. Now I havent had much time to work on it so this is what I have done so far. Its a great kit. Its not perfect but after doing this much on the pod I will be able to make my second one faster and better.

Just for some perspective on it incase your like me and havent seen a drop pod in person before.. Its pretty big. With the doors down its footprint is roughly that of a landraider. but wider.

So that is it. More to come as I finish it and the other stuff i said prior to this I will put up here eventually. Until then. Take care

Thats not a Cannon..

Hey all. So yes I switched to the Drop pod. I just had to. Progress is slow because real life gets in the way as I'm sure we all know. SO hear is a door finished just to get an idea of the color scheme I'm going with.
It is for my Angels of Fury army. I will have to get at least one more Drop pod for the army proper but that is another story. It is going to be for my Sternguard (Which I am calling Interdiction squads) though. And the area around the aquila has been touched up so it looks better now. Its a simple color scheme.

The Kit for the pod is great. A little daunting to look at at first but its straightforward with the instructions. It comes with aquilas or chapter specific icons. Black Templars, Dark Angels, Blood Angels, Ultramarines, Space Wolves and Imperial Fists which could function as Crimson Fists no problem. And there is one for each door. So that is nice. And its made to be able to open and close the doors. Having it in person it is bigger then I would have thought. Not a bad thing just didn't expect it.

So more to come on the Drop pod. I also plan to do a segment look at Stubborn and Fearless. Not so much pitting them against each other but more looking at what they do. I love both of them and I think there both great. Yea even in massive ork armies that cant make the saves. Ill explain why in that segment whenever I do it. And don't worry I haven't forgotten about my Crusade Era Thousand Sons I just wanted do the Drop pod and take a little break from them.

That reminds me I will also do a Segment for the Army lists for both my Angels of Fury Dark Angels Succesor chapter (Using the new SM codex list) and for my Crusade Era Thousand Sons. When I dunno yet but I will and ill do a progressive paint log on them as I finish units or transports for units except for the crusade era thousand sons. Ill do shots of them as I finish batches of em and again with the army as a whole as I finish units to see the progression. Kind alike a checklist thing Anyways..

If you have the new Drop pod or Thunderfire Cannon tell me what you think of the kits.

The Beginning of a Thunderfire Cannon

Greetings. As I stated before ill be giving the Thunderfire Cannon a go and see how far I get on it.

These are the pieces of it. I am not doing the Techmarine Yet. He will be done after or if i get fed up ill switch to him. Its all pewter unfortunately which means assembly will be a bit of a nuisance.

A note on assembling it. I started a little bit or rather tried. The cannon part of this thing does line up right and I'm having trouble getting it to fit right. I ran out of ideas on it so I'm going to start work on this thing in reverse order and work on the treads and mount for it first. If the thunderfire cannon itself was plastic this would be a lot easier. I may switch gears and work on the drop pod first depending on if I give in to the drop pod calling to me.